No, gatekeepers suck. Let people enjoy their things, them enjoying it doesn’t somehow rob your ability to enjoy it. Look at it this way, everyone was a new fan who didn’t know but the band’s 3 most popular songs. Maybe instead of shitting on them, recommend some cool songs based on what they already like? Explain some of the meaning in their music? Do literally anything but “NOT METAL!” or “NOT A REAL FAN!”
Do you feel better now? If you are going to shows for these bands you’ll never see me, im at the metal and punk shows. Enjoy the butt rock I’m happy for u
Are you fine with cultural appropriation in general? Should the dominant culture get to redefine minority cultures without their input? Why is it any different with music subcultures?
You can enjoy all the hard rock and -core bands you want, just don’t try to steal the term metal from the metalheads.
Cultures assimilate, grab ideas from each other, and split off into their own new things. It’s how humans have always worked. There’s no problem with it, if it’s not done with malice or ignorance. This is how we get fun, new sounds, fun, new ideas, and it doesn’t kill anything you love.
There’s a pretty big difference between a culture choosing to assimilate and outsiders trying to steal a culture’s identity because they want to appropriate the culture’s history and cachet.
Again, you can have your new ideas and sounds all you want. Just call them something else.
They’re directly spun off from metal often. That’s why they’re called subgenres.
Cultures can’t decide things, they aren’t entities of themselves. They’re collectives of people. By simply existing within the metal culture and literally any other culture, you are effectively assimilating, bringing in new ideas and perspectives. Unless your culture is literally only ever interacting with themselves. Which sounds pretty fucking bland.
What even is just “metal” anyway? It’s kind of a useless term on its own. It’s an umbrella, and all you’re deciding at this point is what that umbrella does and doesn’t include. Is Ozzy metal? Iron maiden? Metallica, slayer, Megadeth, anthrax? They all use metal in their name. They all sound distinctly metal, but they’re also completely different sounds, from completely different subgenres that to say they’re the same is ridiculous. And at the same time you show me one person who doesn’t identify one of them as metal, and I’ll show you someone who’s wrong.
Of course the culture gets to decide. It does it when members “gatekeep” and say “that’s not metal”. Culture is the rough consensus of the group and what they decide to include or exclude.
Some of my favorite bands are post-black metal. They’re bands who used to make black metal or were inspired by it but went on to make non-black metal music. It’s the same idea as post-punk. Post-punk is inspired by punk but is not punk. Just because it shares influence does not mean it’s part of it.
We can debate specifics on what is and isn’t metal, but honestly I think that’s a distraction from the point I’m trying to make. The point is it’s up to the people in the metal culture to decide what is and isn’t metal and it completely fine for them to defend their culture by gatekeeping.
There’s nothing to defend though. You’re walling in this beautiful culture that, if given half an opportunity, most of the people being gate kept would likely grow to love and introduce their own new, unique twists on the things already here. That’s a good thing last I checked. Only creation, no destruction.
The reason I bring up different metal groups and genres is that it’s basically the entire argument. There’s no distinction besides an arbitrary one. There’s no unified, defining force saying “ok this is metal, period.” There are some INCREDIBLY broad musical characteristics that “may” be heard in metal. Metal is like lewd - I’ll know it when I see it.
gatekeepers are good they protect that scenes culture from dumb ass “normies” who want to repurpose it.
No, gatekeepers suck. Let people enjoy their things, them enjoying it doesn’t somehow rob your ability to enjoy it. Look at it this way, everyone was a new fan who didn’t know but the band’s 3 most popular songs. Maybe instead of shitting on them, recommend some cool songs based on what they already like? Explain some of the meaning in their music? Do literally anything but “NOT METAL!” or “NOT A REAL FAN!”
agree to disagree. good things half these bands arent even metal. People who know nothing about a something speaking on it with authority sucks.
Glad I’ve never met anyone like you at a show rofl. You lot are miserable.
Do you feel better now? If you are going to shows for these bands you’ll never see me, im at the metal and punk shows. Enjoy the butt rock I’m happy for u
Are you fine with cultural appropriation in general? Should the dominant culture get to redefine minority cultures without their input? Why is it any different with music subcultures?
You can enjoy all the hard rock and -core bands you want, just don’t try to steal the term metal from the metalheads.
Cultures assimilate, grab ideas from each other, and split off into their own new things. It’s how humans have always worked. There’s no problem with it, if it’s not done with malice or ignorance. This is how we get fun, new sounds, fun, new ideas, and it doesn’t kill anything you love.
There’s a pretty big difference between a culture choosing to assimilate and outsiders trying to steal a culture’s identity because they want to appropriate the culture’s history and cachet.
Again, you can have your new ideas and sounds all you want. Just call them something else.
They’re directly spun off from metal often. That’s why they’re called subgenres.
Cultures can’t decide things, they aren’t entities of themselves. They’re collectives of people. By simply existing within the metal culture and literally any other culture, you are effectively assimilating, bringing in new ideas and perspectives. Unless your culture is literally only ever interacting with themselves. Which sounds pretty fucking bland.
What even is just “metal” anyway? It’s kind of a useless term on its own. It’s an umbrella, and all you’re deciding at this point is what that umbrella does and doesn’t include. Is Ozzy metal? Iron maiden? Metallica, slayer, Megadeth, anthrax? They all use metal in their name. They all sound distinctly metal, but they’re also completely different sounds, from completely different subgenres that to say they’re the same is ridiculous. And at the same time you show me one person who doesn’t identify one of them as metal, and I’ll show you someone who’s wrong.
Of course the culture gets to decide. It does it when members “gatekeep” and say “that’s not metal”. Culture is the rough consensus of the group and what they decide to include or exclude.
Some of my favorite bands are post-black metal. They’re bands who used to make black metal or were inspired by it but went on to make non-black metal music. It’s the same idea as post-punk. Post-punk is inspired by punk but is not punk. Just because it shares influence does not mean it’s part of it.
We can debate specifics on what is and isn’t metal, but honestly I think that’s a distraction from the point I’m trying to make. The point is it’s up to the people in the metal culture to decide what is and isn’t metal and it completely fine for them to defend their culture by gatekeeping.
There’s nothing to defend though. You’re walling in this beautiful culture that, if given half an opportunity, most of the people being gate kept would likely grow to love and introduce their own new, unique twists on the things already here. That’s a good thing last I checked. Only creation, no destruction.
The reason I bring up different metal groups and genres is that it’s basically the entire argument. There’s no distinction besides an arbitrary one. There’s no unified, defining force saying “ok this is metal, period.” There are some INCREDIBLY broad musical characteristics that “may” be heard in metal. Metal is like lewd - I’ll know it when I see it.
Doesn’t that imply every cultural collision, including the ones that created metal, are bad and should be reversed?
See you at lute practice, bro. I don’t what to hear any of that Bach garbage. It’s not even music.