I thought it was just wrapped in plastic at first and was confused until I realized those were scratches on the front glass.
It wouldn’t have gotten so scratched up if you’d have left it home. Jeez.
(J/K)
Yeah, got one just like that.
Helmet means full face, fuck everything else.
This breaks the rider’s collarbone. (Still better than not having a face though)
We have laws which force people to wear helmets, and wear seat belts. These are common sense laws to prevent people from killing themselves. Nobody bats an eye.
This is the example I’d use during covid when people were complaining about masks being against their rights, even when it would protect them from being sick.
My guy, you’re someone who wouldn’t wear a helmet if the laws had only just changed to enforce them. You’re a hazard to yourself.
My guy, you’re someone who wouldn’t wear a helmet if the laws had only just changed to enforce them. You’re a hazard to yourself.
Also, in countries with socialized cost of healthcare, you have a duty to do your best to avoid becoming a weight for your society.
In Florida Darwin wrote the NTSB standards.
There are people who try to bypass those also, or cheat em. Usually for some personal comfort. One of my sisters was like this. She wasn’t that tall, and complained the seat belt shoulder part was uncomfortable, so she’d either not wear it or put that part behind her.
Then someone swung into her lane causing her to rear end em (she was in a moving normal speed lane and they were backed up in an exit lane). Without the seat belt there, what instead slowed her movement forward was the steering wheel shattering her jaw. She’s fine now, but a painful lesson that included reconstructive surgery.
And does she wear a seat belt now?
Yep, I just meant there are too many people who don’t use something until they get hurt, or something similar. I have a seatbelts on or I stop driving rule, and I do sometimes have to tell people. Including different siblings from the one who got hurt.
I also have a seatbelts on or I stop driving rule. A lot of people don’t want rides from me after I enforce that rule. Like, I’m responsible for their lives as the driver. If they die because they aren’t wearing their seatbelts while I was driving, it’s my fault for not making them buckle up. I even have seatbelts for my dogs because I want them to be as safe as I am. Passengers lives’ are in your hands when you drive. It’s really scary if you actually think about it in depth.
My ex wife was in one of those 1 in 1 million accidents where wearing a seatbelt would have done more damage than not wearing it. Now she never wears her seatbelt because “a doctor” once said in her particular one off experience he was glad she wasn’t wearing one. SMH. I tried to explain how wearing a seatbelt is safer in almost every other account, but she doesn’t listen. It’s just a matter of time till my son doesn’t have a mother anymore.
You’re a hazard to
yourselfothers.Only psychologically, it may not be pretty but the direct physical harm of not wearing a helmet is largely restricted to the rider.
Buh muh rightzz!!
There are still plenty of idiots who make a stink about helmets and seat belts unfortunately.
I’m confident the overlap between seatbelt and mask wearing is >99%
Fuck anyone who advocates against wearing a full-faced helmet. Fuck modular too, the kind moto cops wear that pop open… Cuz guess when they’ll unfortunately pop open?
There’s a fortnine video advocating against wearing armor, that kevlar alone would take care of abrasion injuries etc. You know what I like when I crash? Not getting pebbles embedded into my elbow or knee flesh.
Have fun, get there, and get old.
ATGATT
Nice misinformation.
I’m assuming you’re referring to the Fortnine video discussing the pads for impact protection and how they don’t protect you from impact. If you’re wearing gear you won’t get pebbles embedded into you. The pebbles will not go through your abrasion gear.
When I started riding I had a BMW modular helmet, Made by Schuberth, those things do not give up. I know some of the Harley-Davidson helmets are Made in China though Scorpion. No thanks.
I unsubbed from fortnine after that, he sucks now
But, the modular helmets are fine if ECE22.06 rated. They have steel latches
Former Motorcyclist here.
The guy I used to ride with died! Collided with a car. He flew off his bike and face first into a pole.
I was never friendly with him. He called me a pussy for wearing a full-faced helmet when we rode, while he was wearing a half-helmet that was like a WW2 replica on his harley. I was the youngest on the ride and he was lecturing me trying to teach me “his ways”.
Well, he’s a meat crayon now.
The people who are telling you to wear protection are still alive.
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I don’t think so. Unfortunately, he did nazi that car that collided with him.
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Jesus Christ…thank you… I’m having a challenging evening and that took me right out the funk.
Lmfao beautiful
I like my modular helmet that pops up. It’s pretty secure and I haven’t seen one pop open during an event. They also say they’re rated to be protective with the face up or closed.
My friend had a minor head injury and his doctor advised him to wear a full face helmet whilst riding his bicycle. The cops pulled him over and he had to show them the note the doctor had written about it. I guess the concern is that if your face is obscured they can’t track you down if you commit a crime? Still seems pretty dumb to me.
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Probably the land of the free********
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Cops are just nosy. No justification. They don’t like people who look weird. That’s how they’re trained to think.
I don’t know… think seems like the wrong word. Maybe trained to react?
i know a couple and i think bullied is a better word
over here they are sometimes bullied into being a certain way
that has to be UK, it just has to be. the CCTV surveillance state is crazy there. (saying this as a Canadian whose face is recorded probably 200 times a day in my city)
Bingo, it is indeed the UK
I’ve never heard of a single person who has regretted wearing a helmet, yet people are still incredibly resistant to the idea.
I just don’t get it.
I spoke with a guy, strong cycling supporter with influence in our local government. He made it clear that he views helmets are unnecessary “with safe cycling infrastructure.”
While I get the logic, the reality is that a large number of crashes (reported as half) are single bike accidents with no involvement of another vehicle (i.e. car).
This is why, even when you look at the underreported stats from the Netherlands, cyclists have very high rates of head injuries. They don’t wear helmets, have the gold-standard cycling infrastructure, yet crack their head open.
The point is, don’t be stupid and just wear a damn helmet.
I don’t get their logic either. You can clip a rock and fall of your bicycle pretty easily at speed. TBI is no joke.
One of my coworkers is a story of a single bike accident. He was riding uphill on a road when his front fork broke. He went over the handle bars and head/face first into the ground. He had his helmet on, and was still knocked out. He was found in the drainage ditch on the side of the road after he was reported missing.
He has no long term damage today, but that certainly wouldn’t be the case if he wasn’t wearing a helmet
WTH how long was he out if they got to the point of reporting him missing?
You don’t have to wait a certain amount of time to report someone missing. If your partner says “On my way home” then is 2 hours late and not responding to calls feel free to report them as missing. They could’ve easily been in a major accident.
Where did that idea even come from?
The longer you take to report someone missing, the harder it is to find them.
I assume from crime dramas to heighten the tension
yeah, that still means the guy was out for 2 hours tho
It’s the “don’t tell me what to do” mindset
I’ve met one; but that case was really stupid: they tried to put on their helmet while cycling and fell. Technically, that accident could have been prevented if they didn’t wear a helmet. It could also have been prevented if they put it on before they started cycling though.
safe cycling infrastructure does nothing to prevent you from having a sudden equipment failure and finding yourself going over the bars face-first, or from just being an uncoordinated idiot who wipes out for no reason and gets a closed head injury. I had a crank fail on my bike once, snapped in half in full sprint and I wiped badly. helmet did its job and I was thankful to have it, because there’s no predicting stuff like that
Yup. I have two family members who were in serious cycling accidents. One was from a stone that he didn’t see. He didn’t have a helmet on and almost didn’t make it.
The second was city incompetence, which resulted in a crash on a bike path. They were wearing a helmet and probably only survived because of it.
I was on a group ride a few weeks back, and one guy’s bike slipped from under him (wet metal bridge) and his head slammed into metal. His helmet destroyed, but he carried on like nothing happened.
oh no never ask the dutch why they are not wearing helmets, the cyclists will send every excuse your way
They just think they’re all such good cyclists, and therefore never have an accident. Weird.
I had only fallen once with my bike as an adult. I live in Sweden and our cycling infrastructure in my town is g r e a t. The problem was that it was spring, so all the gravel/sand which had been spread during the winter was now on bare asphalt. I turned left and while the wheel turned, the bike did not.
There ain’t much good infrastructure can do about gravel on asphalt.
Thankfully I didn’t hit my head as it would’ve surely been a pretty bad accident. Instead I just hit every single boney part on my left side.
I always wear a helmet, except in bed.
different kind of helmet
One of the most absurd things I’ve gotten heavily downvoted for on reddit is for saying people should wear helmets no matter how good the cycling infrastructure is. Not that it should be demanded by law, but that it’s simply the wise thing to do. Then people are like ‘wELL I gUeSs YoU ShOUld THeN wEaR a HElmEt whiLE walKinG tOo’
Fine, then don’t wear a helmet. It’s not my head.
I didn’t use to wear one when I was a kid either but nowdays it feels like driving without a seatbelt. Hell, I might even just take my bike for a test drive around the block after having done some adjustments on it and I still go grab my helmet first.
Not that it should be mandated by law, but that it’s simply the wise thing to do. Then people are like 'wELL I gUeSs YoU ShOUld THeN wEaR a HElmEt whiLE walKinG tOo
I don’t think people really understand just how devastating head injuries can be, and just how easy it is to get a tbi when on a surface as hard as concrete.
Even when doing something as simple as walking/running on wet concrete is deceptively dangerous. Every summer the trauma ward I work in has to deal with dozens of kids acquiring life altering tbi for doing something as mundane as running near a pool.
The ironic thing about bikers not wanting to wear helmets is that if you’re not lucky, you’ll end up being fit with a soft shell one at the hospital after you’ve bashed your head anyways. I’ve fit a bunch of people with orthopedic helmets for not wearing helmets over the years.
TBI = traumatic brain injury.
Yep. I was friends with someone both before and after they bashed their skull on concrete in a roller skating accident. They were never the same, and they weren’t different for the better.
dozens of kids acquiring life altering tbi for doing something as mundane as running near a pool.
😬 yeesh, the mental image.
Yeah, pediatric care is both tremendously rewarding and horrendously soul crushing depending on what department you’re working in. You eventually build up some callouses over the years, but I’d be lying if I didn’t admit summers haven’t lost some of its luster because of my job.
Engaging with families who went from having some of the best time of their lives to the worst moments of their existence over the course of the evening is still tough.
At that point, just let them self-select out of the gene pool. In a few generations, maybe our descendants won’t be so adverse to basic self-preservation and common sense.
it’s crazy how my brother doesn’t wear a helmet. Even my adrenaline junkie dad always wore a helmet (he did have some accidents when he was younger so that probably helped)
“Don’t you know, our hierarchy of safety controls is so good, we don’t even bother with PPE at our site” said no intelligent engineer ever.
Resistance to PPE (helmets) baffling. It’s such low effort to wear. I feel naked without it because I’m just used to it (Australia, helmets by law, but also by common sense to me…)
This is why, even when you look at the underreported stats from the Netherlands, cyclists have very high rates of head injuries. They don’t wear helmets, have the gold-standard cycling infrastructure, yet crack their head open.
This is just completely wrong. Netherlands overall has half the per-capita TBI deaths as compared to the US. Now, is a higher portion of their TBI deaths bike-realated – I mean sure, because lots and lots of cycling is done there – and not as much car-driving. But your chances of getting your head smashed is lower overall compared to the US, even with our stupid obsession with helmets.
This is just completely wrong.
Nope.
“While national infrastructure ministry figures report 14,000 seriously wounded cyclists in 2019, the most recently recorded year, VeiligheidNL estimates that there were actually some 80,000 injuries of which 50,000 were serious. The organisation reportedly came to its estimate on the basis of 14 accident and emergency wards’ figures.” (SOURCE)
And…
“A new report from the Dutch road safety research foundation predicts that if cyclists in the Netherlands always wore a helmet, there would be 85 fewer road deaths a year.” (SOURCE)
So yeah, while their per capita rates may be lower than some other countries (or higher when you factor in the extra 80,000 injuries they failed to include in their figures…), the fact remains that cycling infrastructure alone doesn’t prevent accidents, and helmets are one way to downgrade the severity of an injury, or avoid injury altogether.
people are still incredibly resistant to the idea
in the us* (for some reason?)
helmets are pretty standard where i live, you will very rarely not see people using it.
helmets are pretty standard where i live, you will very rarely not see people using it.
Do you have laws that require them to be worn? Australia, for example, has mandatory helmet laws.
I
No kidding, that’s my helmet after a slide at 100km/h
Just curious, how are you after that? I trust my helmet and feel safe about my head, but I’m worried about fractures.
Every crash is a bit different, but overall tbi are the most dangerous aspects of survivable motorcycles mva. For the most part, fractures aren’t as big of a deal as one would first think. Mostly because if you end up laying your bike down and then hit something at speed you’re either dead, or in such bad shape that fractures are the least of your worries.
Soft tissue damage is usually what you’ll see in accidents not involving another vehicle. Lots of gnarly hematoma, lacerations, and friction burns, which will need to be debrided by a nurse with an acrylic brush and saline. Judging by the amount of tough biker dudes I’ve seen scream and cry for their moms during brushy brushy time…it seems like one of the more painful things that happen in the trauma ward.
Oh, and last but not least… Motorcycle mva are one of the most common reasons for traumatic based castrations. In accidents where the rider is ejected forward, their boys will make some pretty extreme contact with the fuel tank. Causing them to swell up to the size of mangos, which often leads to the need for surgical removal.
My head was absolutely fine, the only real injury was a dislocated shoulder.
Mine wasn’t nearly as bad looking but I was going maybe 40, just some minor scratches. However, when I took off the chin bar I realized the anchor was close to torn out and there were spots in the EVA foam that cracked. Wearing a helmet saved me from a pretty nasty head injury or worse.
I know this. I used to ride. Got hit by a car swiping three lanes across traffic. They didn’t care to look. My head whacked the pavement hard. Got road rash and a concussion. The helmet saved my life though.
Weirdly had PTSD after trying to ride again and dropped it like a bad habit. Helmets save lives, on bicycles too y’all.
You kidding me? Not weird to have PTSD at all. Your conscious brain might have shrugged it off but your body remembers the whole “I could have died” feeling.
Yeah, that’s a common experience after bad motorcycle crashes. Glad you’re still with us!
Thank you! very appreciative to be alive!
A few years back I was training to ride the Seattle to Portland in the 1-day format. Had a training regimen I put together and was steadily progressing and building endurance and strength.
One day I go on a training ride on a very cold and rainy December day in Seattle. Decide to take the trail that rides through the train yard then pedal up to the docks.
As I’m riding along the trail there’s this segment that crosses some train tracks at an angle. The temperature is also colder here next to the shore than by my home and the rain here is mixed with snow.
Having ridden this segment dozens if not a couple hundred times in rain or shine, I didn’t think too much of it. However the added mix of snow and colder temps caused those rails to become the slickest surface known to man.
I come up to the gentle curve at speed, my front tire hits the rail of the track and my bike goes sideways while I continue moving forward. I land in puddle on my right side and then the water acts like a slip-N-slide on the blacktop and I proceed to slide along the trail at speed and slam head first, which deflected to the side, then followed up to my right shoulder, into a bollard.
I was wearing a helmet when this happened and I still laid dazed in that cold ass puddle for a good 2-3 minutes before standing up, pulling myself together, and called my wife to pick me up and take me to the ER to get the confirmation that I had a concussion and to rule out anything worse. My shoulder was also bruised and sore for a good week.
Even with the helmet, I had memory issues for 6-10 months.
If I weren’t wearing a helmet I’m not sure I’d be here telling this story. If I were to have survived I would have had some serious trauma and recovery if not permanent damage.
Cool but can I get another model? I feel like the white shit wouldn’t be great for visibility
- Dress for the slide, not for the ride
- ATGATT
- Gray-haired riders don’t get that way from luck
What others did I miss?
- If your helmet doesn’t have a chin bar (full or modular), you don’t care about your chin, teeth, or nose.
- wrt ATGATT, most of that gear will reduce or avoid injury. A helmet will prevent your death.
- If you don’t wear earplugs - even with a helmet on - enjoy your tinnitus and/or hearing loss. This is from wind noise, not engine noise.
A friend of mine crashed her motorbike a few years ago and her face bounced off the road. Her chin bar flexed inwards so much that it broke her nose and chipped a front tooth.
She was furious that the helmet didn’t protect her properly, until her husband who was riding behind her pointed out that she essentially landed face first at over 60mph, and that without the helmet, her face would have taken the full force of the landing.
Yeah, that was probably a “anything less than a chin bar and you’d be super dead” incident.
If your helmet doesn’t have a chin bar (full or modular)
Modular helmets will not protect your face adequately in a crash. Even with a chin bar, the face part tends to open up when you hit the ground. If you value your face, get a good full-face helmet. I have an AGV K1; it’s good, fairly lightweight, acceptably ventilated, and usually under $200. You don’t need to get a Shoei or an Arai; any full-face helmet sold on e.g. Revzilla is going to be fine, as long as it fits.
The AGV K1 looks like a motorcycle helmet. Would you wear something that heavy duty for commuting on a 20-30mph scooter/e-bike? Or is there something else a little more lightweight?
Honestly … yes. On a small ebike or scooter, commuting with automobile traffic, an accident where a helmet will help you seems likely to come from a car not seeing you and hitting you at speed - more than 20 or 30 mph. The kind of thing that’s going to put you up on a windshield, or at best send you tumbling in an uncontrollable way (I’m thinking a car making a right turn across your path where you don’t have time to stop).
This applies even more if you’re a cyclist who doesn’t stop for stop signs or red lights. Not saying that you personally are one of those, but you know they exist, and such people would be well-served by a proper helmet helmet instead of a styrofoam skull cap.
To be fair, motorcycle helmets use the same technology as bicycle helmets do: EPS foam that crushes and breaks in a crash, rather than sending the kinetic energy straight into your skull and brain. Motorcycle helmets have a bit more EPS foam, cover more area, and have heavier shells, because you don’t have to worry as much about ventilation on a motorcycle as you do on a bicycle, and weight is really important when you’re on a bicycle. While there are a small handful of full-face bicycle helmets, they aren’t very reasonable for most people that are commuting.
And yeah, if you’re on a bicycle, please stop at red lights, and at least look before rolling through stop signs.
Parent commenter was asking about scooters or ebikes, not pedal-only bicycles. Helmet weight isn’t nearly the same kind of concern there.
Even so, if you’re on an actual pedal bicycle with automobile traffic, sacrificing some weight savings for increased face savings is worth considering. Perhaps a motocross helmet would be more appropriate?
I was assuming that it was bicycle helmets that you were referring to with the comment about a ‘styrofoam [sic] skull cap’.
I used to commute about 28 miles/day in Chicago by bicycle (I lived in the Little Village, Humboldt Park, and then Austin neighborhoods while I was working in Skokie); a heavier, fuller-coverage helmet is miserable outside of late fall/winter. The weight and ventilation difference is far, far bigger than you can imagine, unless you’ve tried it. Overall, I would recommend using a bicycle helmet when you’re on a bicycle, and a motorcycle helmet when you’re on anything with a motor.
Yes. People die bumming around at 20-30mph without a helmet. People wearing a helmet have slid at over 100mph and got up, brushed themselves off, stood the bike back up, and rode away.
I would ask yourself what you think hitting the ground face-first at 30mph would feel like, and then use that when you consider whether you want a full-face helmet or not. :)
My wife refused to get a helmet when we got bikes because “I’ve never had an accident on a bicycle and we don’t go fast enough to need it” , so I said “Fine, we’ll have this discussion after the first ride”
I got up to the top speed of the speed-controller ebike, she followed, and when we stopped it old her to imagine a puppy runs out in front of her, she has nowhere to go but straight into a wall and smash her head into the concrete, the trees and smash her head into the wood, or jump off the bike and smash her head into the pavement. Because in a crash, your head is going to hit something, and in this case you could be the most careful person on the planet but you can’t stop a puppy, or child, or DUMP TRUCK from blocking your path and forcing you to make a hard choice in less time than it takes to sneeze.
She decided to pick a helmet.
The hard surface your head will bounce off or grind into will not be nice about you failing to wear a helmet. Neither will I.
Even with a chin bar, the face part tends to open up when you hit the ground.
That’s just not true.
Modular helmets are less safe than full-face helmets, period, full stop. That’s absolutely undeniable. Take a look at the SHARP ratings for the very best modular helmet they rated, the Shoei Neotec 3; “93% Percentage of impacts where the face guard remained fully locked”. That means that 7% of the time, in controlled tests, the face guard came unlocked. (BTW, A Shoei Neotec was my first helmet, before I got over my claustrophobia.) That is not something you want to worry about in a crash, especially since real world crashes are not carefully controlled.
There’s a reason that you’re not going to get away with wearing a modular helmet at a track day; they simply are not as safe as a proper full-face helmet.
Good to see that you agree that
Even with a chin bar, the face part tends to open up when you hit the ground.
isn’t true.
7% of the time is a tendency
“Tends to” implies that it’s more likely to happen than not.
That’s your very best-case scenario, with a $600 helmet, in controlled impacts. Once you start looking at real-world crashes, those numbers start going up significantly, especially because you don’t hit the ground once. If you hit the ground at speed, you bounce, and you roll.
Once you start looking at real-world crashes, those numbers start going up significantly,
Source?
More motorcycle specific, but here’s a couple
- What’s a five letter word for road rash?
answer
jeans
- it doesn’t matter how good of a driver you are when there’s so many shitty ones out there.
I’ve heard that one phrased a lot of ways.
EDIT: took me five tries to get the spoiler right : D
Just remember that ATGATT means helmet, jacket, pants, gloves, and boots, and all of them have to be intended and rated for riding.
Most “riding” jeans are trash, not worth the money you pay; they’ll have a little bit of Kevlar lining, and maybe a hint of padding at the knees, but that’s not going to help you significantly. Do yourself a solid and get some real riding pants that zip to your jacket, like RevIt!, or Dianese.
Leather costs more up front, and less in the long run. Textile apparel is usually destroyed in a crash, but leather is usually good for multiple drops. I’ve had four crashes (none hugely significant; partial tear to a rotator cuff on the last one); my jacket and pants look rough, but they’re still perfectly fine for protection.
Pants and jacket should fit fairly closely; you don’t want them moving around when you crash. Loose is not your friend in a crash. They should have CE1 or CE2 inserts at the knees, hips, coccyx, back, shoulders, and elbows. You may need to buy the inserts separately.
You can get pants and jackets used safely, as long as they’re in good condition.
Get gloves with palm sliders. Replace gloves about annually if you put more than 5000 miles on your bike each year; the palms will wear thin, and protect less as they get used. Gauntlets will protect your wrists; I suggest them over shorties. How much are your hands worth to you? Spend that much on gloves. I’ve burned through multiple pairs of Alpinestars Supertech and Knox Handroid gloves, and I’m currently using Five RFX1; these are daily ride gloves for me. (Supertech gloves are nice, except the palm slider is aramid fabric instead of TPU. Is $500 a lot for gloves? Sure. It’s about $15,000 less than reconstructive hand surgery though.)
Boots should protect your ankles; they should have some kind of armored cup there if they’re leather.
Do not accept anything less than a full-face helmet. Just, don’t. Never, ever, ever buy a used helmet. Never, ever, ever buy a helmet that isn’t from a recognized brand, and from a reputable source. (Amazon is not a reputable source.) If a helmet seems too cheap to be true, do not buy it. Helmets are one-crash only; if your head touches the ground, replace the helmet.
Don’t wear this particular helmet, kiddo
Good time to remind people, any helmet that has been in a crash, even ones that have just been banged around really hard, should not continue to be used.
Helmets have crush zones and structures that are designed to fail (inside and out) to protect you, but once they’re used/deformed theyre done. Reusing a helmet beats nothing but you really should get a new one after each incident.
Idk, I had a few minor accidents with mine and it looks and sits ok. I think it’s a rumor, spread by moto equipment corporations in order to prevent me from ending my own life in the next one
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11 now. I wonder how high it will go.
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Writing is even harder
A little too subtle there, methinks
Cat owner?
Please don’t forgot to wear a helmet when riding on 4 wheelers or ATVs. I’ve seen far too many life changing injuries on those damn things. I forced my own brother to get a good helmet when he had one and it saved his life. He flipped the damn thing on top of him and only came out with a shattered wrist. His helmet cracked like an egg but his head was fine.
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Please don’t forgot to wear a helmet when riding on 4 wheelers or ATVs.
Also, just because it claims to be an all terrain vehicle doesn’t make it true. I would avoid riding these in any wooded areas or on sloped or rough terrain while riding solo.
I work in a trauma ward that has an ATV season. I feel like the stigma of wearing helmets has reduced over the years, as I’m having to put less people in orthopedic helmets every year. However, there are just as many people getting crushed by their vehicles.
4 wheelers have a nasty habit of rolling and pinning their riders. If this happens and you’re alone it can easily cripple or kill you. One of the more common severe injuries is having your leg pinned against the motor or exhaust and having your leg or arm slowly cooked to the point where they need to be amputated.
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I met a guy in middle school that got pinned under his dad’s 4-Wheeler. If he’d not been alone, he could have easily been pulled out, but he was suffocated by the 4-wheeler. No traumatic injuries at all. Just slowly ran out of air.
Unfortunately, that’s not an uncommon experience. For some reason a lot of parents who normally wouldn’t leave their kids unsupervised with a 700 pound piece of industrial machinery, are completely okay with letting them operate and drive a 700 pound piece of equipment with virtually no safety features.
